Rob Torckler Do you think over the next two our so years we could find a way to capture the imaginations of the one million who did not vote last time? Maybe find a way to alert this powerbase to the reality of it's existence - to harness this guaranteed solidarity into one body with the only thought in mind of being the change agent.. perhaps something worthy of thought(?)10 hours ago · ·
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Stuart Clarke NZ has its head so far up its bum its scary. But so long at the masses have enough KFC, smoke and lion red provided by mortgaging the future diminished income of our children nothing will change until they go to the money machine on bene day and nothing comes out....then they will stamp their feet and sqeal like babies.....thts it all unfair and the rich have taken all the money....boo hooo poor me!!!10 hours ago · · 2- Stuart Clarke That the one million do not vote due to apathy and ignorance is probably a good thing. The apathetic ignorant and lazy will generally be attracted to the free money mob (green, labour, mana etc) and that gentlemen is the root cause of so much of our underlying problems. Politicians who cant wait to get their hand on the public cheque book in order to buy votes to maintain their careers in parliament.10 hours ago · · 1
- Rob Torckler Harsh, Stuart, and sure, these are the problems the problems the problems - is there an hope left? shall I roll over so you can get to my kidneys with yer boots?10 hours ago ·
Christopher Mark Wingate It may be harsh but sadly it is true too many kiwi want/demand free money free living no mining more hospitals more schools Maori schools no foreign investment etc etc9 hours ago · · 1- Stuart Clarke Theres plent of hope.......bur role over now and I will get to work....Now isnt that better. LOL.9 hours ago ·
Aaron C Torkil People are starting to wake up to produce their own food for their communities and family groups. Soon in the future ( if it isn't criminalised) wealth will no longer be counted in mere monetary value9 hours ago · · 1
Kevin Owen "yet somehow I fear the liability of mass stupidity will win and nothing will save them from themselves."
I think that's a planet wide problem, not just NZ. Maybe if we had a "Science of the mind" that could handle stupidity and increase inteligence, we might find a way out. Most people just rant about it but have no solutions.
Of what must a science of mind be composed?
http://www.psychosomatic-healing.c o.nz/ scope-of-dianetics.html 
www.psychosomatic-healing.co.nz 1. It is an organized science of thought built on definite axioms (statements o...See More9 hours ago · ·
Gerard Christensen Most people these days have grown up in the socialist dreamland..and won't wake up until its too late.9 hours ago · · 1
Robert Lee Gerard - you m ean "The Democratic Socialist Republic of New Zealand"?
(Borrowed that from Sri Lanka, but it seems so appropriate...)8 hours ago · · 1
Peter Jacobsen Judging by the countries that are not socialistic such as the USA,Philippines South Africa I prefer to be in a socialist country.8 hours ago ·- Stuart Clarke all of the above ARE socialist countries.........there is no genuine free market countries that respect individual rights8 hours ago · · 1
- Aaron C Torkil u.s govt debt is 7 times the size of its revenue ... and the fed need to hold interest rates at near zero(and print oggles of money) to keep the system running.7 hours ago ·
Harvindar Singh ...same shit guys year in year out, where are the solutions then - if you keep doing the same thing [pure democracy and capitalism] you will only keep getting the same results...7 hours ago · · 2- Robert Lee Mr Singh, quite clearly we need less government - we can't afford the one we have. I would start by not hiring any new government employees - especially Police and CYF social workers. Natural attrition should get us down to half the number as present in a few years and then review. Apply the same principle across all of government
Working for the government should be stigmatysed - considered glorified dole bludging. There should be a limit on the number of years someone can work for the government before returning to the Private Sector. As in America, the new Prime Minister should bring in a new public service - peole who are brought in to serve - in the public interest for a relatively brief time.
Due to over-exposure to the trough, public servants are unable to think in a capitalist / entreprenurial / fiscally responsible way.7 hours ago · · 1 - Stuart Clarke solutions are clear, simple and straight forward....GET POLITICIANS OUT OF THE F.........G WAY. tHEN WE WILL SEE THE ECONOMY SOAR.7 hours ago · · 1
- Robert Lee Get the whole of government out the way. When it comes to governmetn less is more. Public Servants and Politicians think more is more.7 hours ago ·
- Stuart Clarke We need to get aggressive and real with getting after investment, growth and jobs. We need to get on "war" footing to mobilize everything we have got or greece here we come. And it must happen. Immediate flat tax of 17% across the board, massive cuts in govt spending, elimination of whole depts, anything commercial replaced by private capital, ACC etc. massive foreign investment in roading, transport and infrastructure....and dont give me the PC line that their is something evil about a foriegn dollar. All they need is a 4/5% return.7 hours ago · · 1
- Aaron C Torkil Nice to know you'd like us to be owned by the chinese or russians .. because that's the only place where "real" money be...7 hours ago ·
- Robert Lee Unlike Greece, New Zealand doesn't have Germany to bail us out. Good thing the Australian constitution provides for us to become another state of Aussie...7 hours ago ·
- Stuart Clarke Not a question of being ownef. FFS we are 260B in the hole to foreign banks allready......and that money was used to pay for the groceries and beneficiaries and pensions................du
h 7 hours ago · - Stuart Clarke Totally agree Robert we should have pushed ahead with CER in the 70's when we had the opportunity BUT our polis wouldn't do it as they knew they would become irrelevant. Big mistake.7 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...and who will govern Gentlemen plus provide industry, business and consumer services - all legislation requires operation...7 hours ago ·
- Aaron C Torkil pensions take up approx %10 of the budget.. the dole is 1.2 % . dpb %2.3 .... if you want cost cutting ... slam a "worker wage" on mp's7 hours ago ·
- Aaron C Torkil What can an mp possibly be doing to justify their salaries plus expenses paid for .7 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate I keep repeating the only answer- Fiduciary Legislation- the removal of crown and judicial immunity- do that NZ will improve overnight7 hours ago · · 3
- Aaron C Torkil Absolutely that and an almighty pay cut would make nz quiet a nice place ...7 hours ago ·
- Stuart Clarke Cut mp numbers by 75%, pay em more and get better people but turn over most govt function to competent private organisations incentivised to get results not pensions and free travel.7 hours ago ·
- Robert Lee Chris, that is one of many sensible improvements that we need to make to our constitution. Oh hang on a minute, we don't even have a constitution. We better get one of those so we can put the Fiduciary Obligation into it...7 hours ago · · 1
- Robert Lee Constitution is Legislation - entrenched, superior legislation. Normal legislation could be changed by the next government. An entrenched constitutional law could only be changed if Parliament had a 75% majority.6 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Imagine politicians taking away accountability legislation that holds politicians and judges accountable6 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...there seems to be a constant confusion here, NZ is a sovereign state not a business or a publicly listed company, very very big difference - businesses and companies must focus purely on profit but a sovereign state must focus on its people and ensure all areas of the economy can function including industries, businesses and consumers...6 hours ago · · 2
- Christopher Mark Wingate It has the same functions as a business- cash in- cash spent- return on investment- that return is the balance sheet-the social return ie lower crime numbers-better more effective education results- all derived from decision making at the top to steer the nation- where is the confusion?6 hours ago ·
- Robert Lee A sovereign state is not immune from financial realities. I think the current focus on that aspect of government is because successive New Zealand governments have failed to live within their means and many see this as a priority issue.
There are two kinds of people [sovereign states]. Those that understand compound interest and those who pay it.6 hours ago · - Harvindar Singh ...wrong Mark, a business makes money from the market and pays its employees a sovereign state can only operate from the money it takes from its people - I repeat NZ is not a company nor should it be run like one, just ask the current idiots in power who are trying to do exactly that and fucking it up...6 hours ago · · 1
- Robert LeeIn a sovereign state taxes = revenue and the cost of public services is its expense. The reality is like a business in that unless your expenses are less than your revenue, you will have to borrow and pay compound interest.
I don't see how a sovereign state is different from a business except that, as Chris says, the state should owe a fiduciary obligation to the people, just as the directors of a company owe a fiduciary obligation to the shareholders.6 hours ago · · 1 - Christopher Mark Wingate The current government took on a mess from the Clark government- but the messes have been going on for 25+ years. As for being wrong I am not- it get money in and decides how it spends that money- where it gets it from is not the point6 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate The MBA Students:
Tell us what the rules of the game are, and we’ll tell you how to win the game.
The Government Students:
Tell us who you want to win the game, and we’ll tell you how to make the rules.6 hours ago · - Harvindar Singh...where is the imagination here guys, this is the same old shit, money in money out I got my profit, now fuck everyone else - again wrong guys, sovereign states make policy where business break rules in order to maximise profit, see the d...See More6 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Wrong- employ them where regulatory controls are needed- that has been the problem in government- idiots employed to make decision- you only need to observe the board table of the major successful companies and compare that to the idiot screaming in parliament - which team do you want running your future?6 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Microeconomics - the study of individuals and business decisions, macroeconomics looks at government decisions.6 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh...I don't want any of them Mark they are shitheads, boards have fucked their own markets and the polys have fucked the countries, remember these fuckers work for us we pay their salaries - we need innovation and imagination not the same shit which conflicts with the natural laws of our existence: -
“…ALL PROGRESS IS THE RESULT OF THAT WHICH IS GONE BEFORE...
...PAST DISCOVERIES, PAST INSPIRATION, PAST INNOVATION. SOME ARE SUCCESSFUL; OTHERS ARE NOT, BUT SOW THE SEEDS FOR FUTURE ACHIEVEMENT...
...LAYER BY LAYER, POINT BY POINT WE ADVANCE…”5 hours ago · 
Darren Rickard The ease of the best moving to Australia mean we have the chaff left behind. Excluding you and me of course. The chaff have their hands out, the wheat, well they get their hands working. Simple as that. When you have more gimmie, gimmies, you have idiots that will vote for morons who will want to give it to them.5 hours ago ·- Harvindar Singh ...not sure Darren, I think it was the gimmie, gimmies that didn't vote cause they knew from the polls that the Nats were going to romp in...5 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark WingateWrong HS- government need to employ efficient corporate hunters to do the same in government- instead of employing lame poor thinking lazy over ego-ed bureaucrats- if we got the bright ones to run the country based on the mandates of the pe...See More5 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...sure Mark, law making is one thing but our polys are democratically elected by the people and the last time I looked the front line members of the Nats are all from big business...5 hours ago ·
- Darren Rickard The gimmies are very close to becoming more than half of us Harvindar. If the good ones keep leaving we will elect even more socialist govts than the current one in the future.5 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate How many Nats have you met- sat in meetings listening to them? I have and 98% of them would be flops in business- that is why they are in politics5 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...you will get no comments from me on the left / right shit or the haves / have nots - one will always try and fuck the other never making any progress. We need to move on to systems that work...5 hours ago ·
- Darren Rickard That is bullshit Chris, at least half of them have been successful business people. You cannot say that about Labour, where your statement rings true.5 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...there is your answer / problem guys - I again repeat NZ is not a busines,s stop trying to run it like one...5 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Key was a currency trader- not a businessman- English from a farming family- Power a lawyer- Joyce was a good businessman- so who else? http://
www.national.org.nz/ MPList.aspx 
www.national.org.nzThe National Party is New Zealand's largest Centre-Right political Party, led by John Key. National primarily targets conservative and classic liberal voters. These include mainstream families, retired people, small business people, the farming and rural communities, and urban professionals.5 hours ago · · - Harvindar Singh ...yeah Mark, Joyce does know business but not public office at all...5 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Give a gun to a fat slob or an athlete- which one would make the better soldier? Joyce has a good mind on balancing budgets- marketing- strategic thinking- I would reply on him way more than the others to look after the country's interests5 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate As for the others they are able to con there way into those positions because there is collective protectionism- little accountability if any-zero fiduciary responsibility- all because they have crown immunity to hide behind4 hours ago · · 1
- Harvindar Singh ...indeed Mark, Joyce would have a good understand of the needs and balance requirements of the State, he has a broadcasting / mass market back ground - the others wouldn't know one end of a budget from the other...4 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...yeah Chris, most of these shitheads do not have the capacity to understand complexity, if they do then they don't know how to make a decision - bit like our current under understanding of quantum mechanics, we will get there but we need to more on from last century thinking...4 hours ago ·
Andre DromgoolWe should look after our own nation's interests rather than those of foreign companies. We should create our own money instead of paying interest to foreign banks. We should ban property sales to non-citizens - they can lease the land inste...See More4 hours ago · · 1- Darren Rickard Key ran a business, as did English, as did Joyce and Power is about to head part of a very large bank. He is a big loss to the party because he ran his portfolio like a business and got results. I was aware he was lawyer. To say Key and English are not successful business people is just sour grapes.4 hours ago ·
- Darren Rickard Yes, lets just print money Andre, one reason why we are in the crapper right now. We do not have inequality of opportunity here. We all have the same opportunity for success. Those state assets are poor returners on capital and that is why under half of each is being sold, to make them more efficient and invest more in ourselves and the businesses.4 hours ago ·
- Andre DromgoolThey may be successful in the spheres of business but what are their real agendas? Who are they trying to reward and why. If Bill English wasn't Minister of Finance, would SCF have been given continued coverage under the CRDGS? How many Lab...See More4 hours ago · · 1
- Christopher Mark Wingate Again- this is why I push for fiduciary law and the removal of crown immunity they hide either incompetence or hidden agenda behind4 hours ago · · 1
- Harvindar Singh ...one has to wonder why utilities such as power generation are private when they form the back bone of any economy - again idiots in power...4 hours ago · · 1
- Harvindar Singh ...it is fascinating, over 800,000 kiwis know how to start and operate a business [albeit small however, still a business] - while 120 polys in parliament have no idea...4 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Very few of those 800,000 would know how to run a major corporation- it is the types who run them we want in government- imagine having them bat for government instead of idiots4 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...the point is they can do it, the polys can't, NZ is a country of small businesses not big and never will be - there are less than 300 major corporation here and the most of them are multi nationals...4 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate To run the nation- select the team from- A- Politicians or B-International successful corporations- me personally- I would hand pick the best from business and get them to turn NZ around3 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...sure these people may know business but do they understand the complexities of serving the public - I doubt it, NZ is not a business...3 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark WingateHa- serving the public- and politicians know how? you must be joking. I think you missed my point completely- you use the abilities of the business savvy skilled trained competitive corporate person to use those abilities to gain the advant...See More3 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...sure Chris, but how would a business savvy harvad educated person make a decision on who is going to get hip replacement or not - my point is educate your people, let the business people do want they like doing, running business, NZ is not a business...2 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Simple- those are the people's mandates- the management team then apply them in the best method possible2 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...Chrissyou presume that the mandate you state is what people want? I am sure the desires of people will very different from business people - I for one wouldn't want my life run by business these people...2 hours ago ·
- Christopher Mark Wingate Well fuck it- let the idiots keep on running NZ into the ground- my point is made- it is simply too hard to get people to understand reality- they fall back on the idiots to keep on doing what they do best- make idiot decisions resulting in NZ being 3rd most indebted nation in the OECD and on the bottom of almost every other developed nation- go figure2 hours ago ·
- Harvindar Singh ...these ideas worked 50 or 60 years ago Chris, they will not serve the masses or be relevant in the future - we must move on and generate value in new and innovative ways and have more flat governance...2 hours ago ·
Saturday, December 31, 2011
The problems of trying to help NZ
From Facebook- you can see the problem
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